The Second Escape: What North Korean Refugees Face After They Cross Into China

Escaping North Korea is not necessarily the hardest part. Many refugees must then escape China.In this episode of Bay Area Innovators, host Steve Ispas sits down with Dan Chung, cofounder of Crossing Borders and author of “Hard Freedom,” who has worked with North Korean refugees in China and South Korea for over 20 years.China does not recognize North Korean refugees, grant them rights, or publish numbers on them. Chung explains what that means in practice: a trafficking industry that sells women crossing the border, a zero-tolerance policy that sends those caught back to prison camps, and surveillance so complete that refugees report having to send police a daily photo of themselves with their husbands.He also walks through the second escape, a 3,000-mile route through China, Laos, and Vietnam to Thailand, where refugees are told the fastest way to gain legal protection is to get themselves arrested.Watch the full episode for a firsthand account of what escaping North Korea actually costs.